Richard Moore — Direct/Cross/Redirect
494 linesCOURT BAILIFF: All rise.
COURT BAILIFF: Please be seated and come to order.
THE COURT: Good morning. Do we have any preliminary matters?
MR. ROTTENBORN: We have some exhibits to hand out.
THE COURT: That would be fantastic. That will make Jamie's day.
THE COURT: All right. Anything else? I 1
MR. ROTTENBORN: Thank you, Your Honor.
THE COURT: All right. We ready for the jury then? Yes, Your Honor.
THE COURT: All right. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Have a seat.
THE COURT: All right. Your next witness.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Your Honor, Amber calls Dr. Richard Moore.
THE COURT: All right. Dr. Moore. RICHARD SUITER MOORE, JR., MD, FAOA, witness called on behalf of the defendant and counterclaim plaintiff, having been first duly sworn by the Clerk, testified as follows: All right. Yes, sir.
THE COURT: EXAMINATION BY COUNSEL FOR THE DEFENDANT AND COUNTERCLAIM PLAINTIFF BY MR. ROTTENBORN:
MR. ROTTENBORN: Good morning, Dr. Moore.
DR. MOORE: Good morning.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Can you please tell the jury your full name?
DR. MOORE: Yes, Richard Suiter Moore, Jr.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Where do you work?
DR. MOORE: EmergeOrtho in Wilmington, North Carolina.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And what is your position there?
DR. MOORE: I'm a shareholder physician, orthopedic practice hand/upper extremity microvascular surgery.
MR. ROTTENBORN: For how many years have you been an orthopedic surgeon?
DR. MOORE: So I completed my fellowship in 1997, so for 25 years.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And I believe that you mentioned this, but tell the jury what area of orthopedic surgery in which you specialize?
DR. MOORE: So I'm a orthopedic surgeon. I O finished medical school, went to a five-year orthopedic surgery residency. At the completion of my residency, I wanted to specialize in hand surgery, so I did an additional year of training, specifically in hand and upper extremity surgery before starting practice in my first year as an attending.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Where are you currently licensed?
DR. MOORE: North Carolina.
MR. ROTTENBORN: For how long have you been licensed?
DR. MOORE: Since 1991 or '6, I think it was 1996 when I was licensed in North Carolina.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Okay Beginning with your undergraduate studies Dr Moore could you please tell the jury a bit about your educational background I know you mentioned a little bit of it just now.
DR. MOORE: So I attended University of North Carolina Chapel Hill, graduated in 1987 with a BS in biology. I went on to medical school at UNC, and I graduated in 1991. I then went to the hospital of the University of Pennsylvania in Philadelphia, did a five-year orthopedic surgery residency there. Then 1996, I went to Duke University Medical Center and did a fellowship in hand/upper extremity micro vascular surgery.
DR. MOORE: On completion of my fellowship, I was invited to join the faculty, and my role was hand and trauma, and so I went to Los Angeles for about six months for a preceptorship in pelvic trauma and then went back to Duke and practiced as a director of the orthopedic trauma service and a member of the hand/upper extremity and micro vascular reconstruction team until 2000 when I relocated in North Carolina, to Wilmington.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And you maintained an active clinical practice since the year 2000?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And before that, when you were at Duke, :5 correct?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Just very briefly can you tell the jury what is a residency?
DR. MOORE: Residency is largely an apprenticeship. So when you finish medical school, you have an MD medical degree but you really can't practice medicine. And you take a tract of internal medicine or pediatrics or OB-GYN, or orthopedics, and then it's a graduated training program, anywhere from three to five or six years.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And what's a fellowship?
DR. MOORE: And a fellowship is a year beyond training. When I completed my residency, had I chose to, I could have practiced as a general orthopedic surgeon. But I wanted to subspecialize, and, therefore, that required an additional year of training.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And I believe you mentioned this, but :3 your subspecialization was in the hand; is that tight?
DR. MOORE: That's correct.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Why did you choose to specialize in the hand? IS
DR. MOORE: Patient population, the types of problems we treat, and the anatomy is really the biggest reason I chose it. I mean, for lack of a better term, it's really pretty, beautiful anatomy.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And let's talk that that anatomy; there's bones in the hand, right?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And then there's tissue and blood I ! 17 vessels, right?
MS. VASQUEZ: Objection. Leading.
THE COURT: Overruled.
MR. ROTTENBORN: I'm sorry. You can go ahead and answer that.
DR. MOORE: Yes, that's correct.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And what is the surgery called where you operate on tissues and blood vessels in the hand?
DR. MOORE: Well, that would be hand surgery. I mean, there are different components of it. There's trauma where we do repairs of tendons or blood vessels. There's a microvascular element where we repair injured nerves. In my practice at Duke, I was on the replant team, and so we would do replantations when digits were cut off. We would try to reattach to bones and tendons and nerves and vessels to reattach the digits and hopefully help them survive.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And have you performed surgeries of that nature?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: When you perform surgeries of that nature, what assessment do you make of the cause of those injuries?
DR. MOORE: So cause is a big element. So it's an important element to appreciate because it can impact management in a lot of those settings. You know, there's a difference between a laceration caused by razor blade and a laceration caused by, say, a serrated knife. There's a larger zone of injury. So what we anticipate having to manage is based on how the injury was created.
DR. MOORE: There's also other elements, contamination. You know, farmyard injuries are totally different than clean injuries, and kitchen with raw chicken are totally different than some O other settings. And so it does play a large role in management.
MR. ROTTENBORN: After your fellowship at Duke University, I believe you mentioned you had another role at Duke for a few years; is that tight? Can you tell the jury about that?
DR. MOORE: So I did my fellowship. Then I joined the faculty as an assistant professor. And so I was in charge of teaching residents and fellows. I was the director of the orthopedic trauma service, and I was on the hand call team in addition.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Have you had academic appointments at any universities other than Duke?
DR. MOORE: I have a adjunct -- assistant professor appointment at the University of North Carolina Chapel Hill, which has facilitated training programs in the center where I practice now.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Have you held any leadership positions in your field? ,8
DR. MOORE: I've been an officer and the past president of North Carolina Society for Surgery of the Hand, the Duke Hand Club - or society now. I'm in the - a member of the American Society for Surgery of the Hand; of the Orthopaedic Trauma Association; of the American Academy of Orthopaedic Surgery; and of the American Orthopaedic Association, the AOA.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Are the majority of your surgeries hand surgeries?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: How many hand surgeries, ballpark, would you say you've performed in your career?
DR. MOORE: Over 25 years, thousands.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Have you seen finger injuries similar, ______ _ to the one sustained by Mr. Depp in Australia?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And have you evaluated injuries like that? .5
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Have you treated injuries like that?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Have you operated on fingers that look like that?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: How many times, ballpark?
DR. MOORE: Hundreds, if not - if not more.
MR. ROTTENBORN: What does it mean to be board certified in your field?
DR. MOORE: So board certification is a process that you pursue after you complete training, so at the time - there have been some changes, but at the time that I finished my training, after residency we took a written examination. And if months to the board, and they picked 12 cases and then you gathered up ten and went to Chicago and had an oral examination based on those cases. And
MR. ROTTENBORN: And your board certification is in what?
DR. MOORE: Orthopedic surgery.
MR. ROTTENBORN: What is a Certificate of Added Qualification?
DR. MOORE: So in the event that you elect to do a fellowship and subspecialize, hand surgery is one of the specialties that you can apply for a Certificate of Added Qualification. And so once I was board certified, I practiced for an additional year or two, had to resubmit a list of cases and take a written examination to become certified in
MR. ROTTENBORN: Do you teach other surgeons how to do hand surgery?
DR. MOORE: Occasionally. On occasion, yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: When was the last time you did so?
DR. MOORE: Day before yesterday.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Tell the jury about that.
DR. MOORE: I was -- over the weekend, I went to Miami to serve as faculty for a course, bioskills course we call it, on shoulder and wrist surgery. And surgeons come in, and we have case presentations and panels. And then they had a cadaver lab, and we were able to allow them to perform the surgery on cadavers to become familiar with the equipment.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Have you published in your field?
DR. MOORE: I have.
DR. MOORE: In peer-reviewed literature? Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Your Honor, at this time we'd like to offer Dr. Moore as an expert in the field of orthopedic surgery and specifically hand surgery and injuries to the hand.
THE COURT: Any objection?
MS. VASQUEZ: No objection, Your Honor.
THE COURT: So moved. Yes, sir.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Dr. Moore, now we get to talk about this case. At our request, what have you reviewed, just general categories of information, have you reviewed in this case?
DR. MOORE: So a tremendous amount of material. I reviewed the video deposition and trial testimony of Mr. Depp regarding the injury, the medical records from Australia, the photographs of the injury from Australia and Los Angeles, texts and emails, the deposition of Dr. Kipper, and I'm sure jlO there's more. / 11
MR. ROTTENBORN: And when you reviewed the deposition of p2 Mr. Depp, was that just in paper form?
DR. MOORE: It was a video deposition.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And so what did you review of that deposition?
DR. MOORE: The section where he describes the injury.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And did you see a video of him describing it?
DR. MOORE: I did.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And you watched the testimony from this trial of him describing it?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And you mentioned that you reviewed some texts as well. What are those?
DR. MOORE: They were communications amongst Mr. Depp and his physician and others.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And what did you specifically review in those texts relating to the finger injury?
DR. MOORE: Well, with relation to the finger, there was a text where he had stated he cut his finger off.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Now, Dr. Moore, I'm going to ask you some questions about this case regarding the opinions that you fanned relating to Mr. Depp's i finger injury. When I ask you those questions, do you ! 17 agree to answer my questions to a reasonable 118 degree of medical probability?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And do you agree to advise the jury and the Court if you are not answering any of them to a reasonable degree of medical probability?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Dr. Moore, based on your analysis, did Mr. Depp's finger injury happen as a result of a vodka bottle being thrown at him?
DR. MOORE: No.
MS. VASQUEZ: Objection. Leading.
THE COURT: Overruled.
MR. ROTTENBORN: I'm sorry?
DR. MOORE: No.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And what is the basis for that opinion?
DR. MOORE: Well, the medical data is inconclusive. It's not consistent with what we see in the described injury pattern or in the clinical photographs. And there are several elements. There's, you know, the description was of a hand being flat on the bar and the bottle crushing the finger from the top. But looking at the images, there's really no significant injury to the dorsum of the finger, and to create the type of injury with that type of a crush injury, we would anticipate both injury to the fingernail and other parts of the finger.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Can I stop you there -- Sure. -- and just break down a few things? bar.
MR. ROTTENBORN: You said the hand resting flat on the Can you show the jury what direction the hand was resting based on the documents you've reviewed?
DR. MOORE: I think the demonstration was with the hand flat, like this (indicating), across maybe even closer to the edge of the bar like this (indicating).
MR. ROTTENBORN: Which side was facing upward? Which side of the hand?
DR. MOORE: The back of the hand, or what we call the dorsal surface of the hand, was up.
THE COURT: Doctor, if you could, get closer to the microphone, I'd just appreciate that.
DR. MOORE: Sorry.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Thank you, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Uh-huh.
MR. ROTTENBORN: So you referred to the back of the hand as the dorsal side of the hand; is that right?
DR. MOORE: That's correct.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Sort of like the dorsal fin on a shark?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Fair? And what is the other side of the hand called?
DR. MOORE: The palmar surface.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Palmar? Okay. So what direction was Mr. Depp's hand resting on the bar?
DR. MOORE: So the dorsal side was up, which with the described mechanism of injury, or the injury of the bottle would have struck the top of the finger at the fingernail.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And you also mentioned the term that I would like you to explain to the jury, "crush injury," please?
DR. MOORE: So with review of the images and the X-rays, I mean, this was a crush injury. That's the - that would generate the findings clinically on X-ray that we saw. The fracture is a, we call it comminuted, and the tip of the finger is in multiple splinters. So there are multiple fragments, and typically you see that with a crush-type injury.
MR. ROTTENBORN: So a comminuted fracture is one where there's multiple fragments of bone?
DR. MOORE: That's correct.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And what was the basis -- other than what you've read and heard from the pictures, what was the basis of your opinion that the hand was resting palmar side down on the bar?
DR. MOORE: Well, that was the way the injury was described and demonstrated in the videos. And so in that position, were the bottle to strike the finger the way it was described, it would have struck on the nail, and the nail was really not injured. And so that's not consistent with that pattern of injury.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Michelle, could I get you to pull up Exhibit DX369, page 26. Your Honor, this is admitted. Ask for permission to publish.
THE COURT: All right. Yes, sir.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Thank you, Your Honor.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Dr. Moore, is this one of the images that you reviewed?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Tell us -- in relation to your expert opinion on the cause of Mr. Depp's injury, tell us what you see in this picture, please?
DR. MOORE: So this is a, looks like an evulsion-type injury where tissue's actually IO pulled or pinched away. I think what's important in this picture is that the tissue loss is on the palmar aspect, from underneath the finger rather than all transversely in the finger, which you would anticipate if the bottle struck the finger. You would expect more of this level of injury, rather than isolated to the palmar aspect.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And what do you notice about the condition of the fingernail in this picture?
DR. MOORE: So from this image, the fingernail appears to be intact. You can't necessarily see the entire nail, but there are other images that have a better profile of that, and the nail's not
DR. MOORE: Elevated. It's not - there's no subungual hematoma underneath it, or there's no bruise underneath it. Anyone that's ever stuck their finger in a drawer or caught it in car door or hit it with a hammer knows that almost immediately, there's typically bleeding underneath the nail which creates this hematoma.
MR. ROTTENBORN: So not being a doctor, I'm going to try to summarize what you just said. Are you saying O that in an injury like this, if something had come from the top, that there would be an immediate impact to the fingernail bed?
DR. MOORE: That's correct.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Michelle, could you please pull up Plaintiffs Exhibit 144.
DR. MOORE: Your Honor, this has been admitted as well.
THE COURT: All right. Thank you. Dr. Moore, I believe you mentioned just a few minutes ago that there were other pictures that showed more of the nail. Is this one of those pictures?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And explain to the jury again, and I'm sorry for the graphic nature of this photo, but it's important that the jury understands the basis for your opinion that a bottle couldn't have caused this coming in from above.
DR. MOORE: Yeah. So it's - again, the mechanism described would have almost certainly led to severe nail injury. You know, I see no subungual hematoma. Again, it's a palmar tissue loss, and the loss is from distal to proximal, which is from the tip, back far below the nail. And so for it to create that tissue loss down there, there would almost certainly have to be injury dorsally with that described mechanism
MR. ROTTENBORN: So what you're saying is that something coming from the top could not have left a nail intact and yet caused injury from tip of the finger underneath the nail?
MS. VASQUEZ: Objection. Leading.
THE COURT: Overruled.
MR. ROTTENBORN: You can answer.
DR. MOORE: So I believe that with the mechanism described, that if the bottle struck the nail, there would have certainly been an injury to the nail bed, and in order for the soft tissue injury to be created by that mechanism, there would have almost certainly been tissue loss on the top of the finger as well.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Does Mr. Depp's description of what happened line up with the undisputed photographic IO evidence that you reviewed?
DR. MOORE: No.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Now, we mentioned the term "crush injury" a few minutes ago. I'd like to show you DX360, please.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And, Your Honor, this is -- we won't publish this at this time.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Is this a document that you reviewed in connection with your expert opinion in this case?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And, Michelle, if you could, please go to pages -- I believe they're 5 and 6. Your Honor, I ask for permission to publish these as a demonstrative to the jury.
THE COURT: Just page 5 and 6?
MR. ROTTENBORN: Sorry. 09 and 10.
THE COURT: Page 09 and 10.
MR. ROTTENBORN: To the jury.
THE COURT: Could you go to 10 also so Jamie can see it?
THE COURT: Okay. Any objection?
MS. VASQUEZ: No, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Okay. 09 and 10 can be published.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Dr. Moore, are these -- what are these pictures of?
DR. MOORE: So these are X-rays of the injured digit.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And what do you observe in these X-rays? Explain to the jury what you see.
DR. MOORE: So these are two views. So one in the plane looking through the finger in this direction, one in the plane looking through the finger sideways, and you can see that the tuft, or the tip of the finger, of the last bone in the finger called the distal phalanx, is shattered. You can see there's multiple little spicules of bone, and there's also a transverse fracture at that level which runs through the bone. So this is -- this is what we would describe as a comminuted fracture, and it's commonly associated with a crush injury.
MR. ROTTENBORN: In your decades of practice, Dr. Moore, IO have you ever seen a comminuted fracture like this result from an object thrown in the way that Mr. Depp described?
DR. MOORE: Well, not in -- not with the constellation of findings shown on the X-rays. I mean, I think that could create a fracture, but in this setting, it wouldn't create a fracture without the associated other injuries that we would anticipate.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And in your decades of practice, when you see a comminuted fracture like this, what are some things that have typically caused it?
DR. MOORE: So crush mechanisms could be slammed in I a drawer, caught between two logs in the fireplace, car door, sliding glass door. Those are all - any mechanism that squeezes the finger between two hard, opposing surfaces could create this type of injury.
MR. ROTTENBORN: In the statements of Mr. Depp that you . reviewed, how did he describe what happened to the I 8 alleged bottle when it hit the bar?
DR. MOORE: I believe he said it exploded, shattered.
MR. ROTTENBORN: If a bottle had exploded near his finger in the way that he alleges, what would you expect to see in the documents that you have reviewed?
DR. MOORE: Well, I think that the physicians did a good job of documenting the presentation of the appearance of the wound. They did not document the presence of any glass shards, and there were no other associated injuries elsewhere on the hand.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And I just want to step back for one minute.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Michelle, can you pull up the next page of the X-ray here. Thank you.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And, Dr. Moore, just before we move on
DR. MOORE: From X-rays, can you -- I know this, when it's Is blown up like this, it's a little bit blurry, but can you point out or describe to the jury where the multiple bone fragments are in the finger? Is So they're in the very tip of the - if you see the joint and then there's the what we call the transverse fracture, which is across the middle of the bone in the same plane as the joint, and then the multiple fragments are in the tuft. And the - with a Xerox copy, the quality's not as detailed as a true X-ray.
MR. ROTTENBORN: You can take that down, Michelle. Thank you.
MR. ROTTENBORN: So back to the glass. In the records that you reviewed, Dr. Moore, did you see any adjacent injuries, in other words, injuries to any other part of Mr. Depp's hand other than the tip of his middle finger?
DR. MOORE: No.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And is that observation consistent with the explosion-of-glass-type phenomenon that Mr. Depp alleges?
DR. MOORE: Well, I think, in the setting of a glass explosion like that where there's multiple fragments that the tip of the finger's cut off, you would anticipate that there would be other lacerations.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Did you review the documentation in the O medical records from the hospital in Australia?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Did any of those providers report retrieving glass from the wound?
DR. MOORE: No.
MR. ROTTENBORN: What about any glass near the site of the injury?
DR. MOORE: No.
MR. ROTTENBORN: What about any glass in other parts of the hand?
DR. MOORE: No.
MR. ROTTENBORN: What about any glass in any of the other fingers?
DR. MOORE: No.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Is there any reference at all, Dr. Moore, that you've seen to any glass in the records that you've reviewed?
DR. MOORE: No.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Dr. Moore, in your decades of practice, have you ever seen an injury associated with a glass explosion that was focused on the end of a single finger in the way Mr. Depp describes?
DR. MOORE: Well, not consistent with the clinical images and the findings in this case, no.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Have you ever seen an injury associated with an alleged glass explosion where no other glass was found on any part of the patient's body or clothing or anything?
DR. MOORE: No.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And because there's been talk of a glass explosion, Dr. Moore, there seems to have been a suggestion that somehow glass maybe sliced off the end of Mr. Depp's finger. Is that what's going on here?
DR. MOORE: This wound doesn't really appear to be a sharp glass laceration.
MR. ROTTENBORN: You referred earlier to an avulsion, which is a term I never heard before your opinion in this case. Explain to the jury what that is, please.
DR. MOORE: So often with crush injuries and we'll see tissue loss that we call an avulsion, where Is the tissue's actually pinched or pulled away j rather than sliced or cut. And it's not uncommon ! 10 with crush injuries to see that.
MR. ROTTENBORN: In your decades of practice, Dr. Moore, have you ever seen an avulsion injury with a partial amputation that results from an object thrown from the top of the finger in the way that Mr. Depp describes?
DR. MOORE: No. Again, I think that the description differs from the clinical appearance on the images.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Michelle, can you please pull up Exhibit 369 at page 12.
MR. ROTTENBORN: This has been admitted, Your Honor. ,22
THE COURT: All right. You can publish, to the jury.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Dr. Moore, you've said you've treated thousands of hand injuries over the course of your Is I Is career, correct?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MR. ROTTENBORN: What is that on Mr. Depp's hand?
DR. MOORE: So we described that as a -
MS. VASQUEZ: Objection. Calls for speculation.
THE COURT: The picture just changed.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Sorry. Page 12, I please.
THE COURT: Okay. Thank you.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Thank you. l,,
MR. ROTTENBORN: What is that on Mr. Depp's hand?
DR. MOORE: That's a plaster -
THE COURT: Overrule the objection.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Thank you.
MR. ROTTENBORN: I'm sorry. Please tell the jury what that is on Mr. Depp's hand.
DR. MOORE: That's a plaster splint, a "half a cast" is how it's sometimes described to patients, and it provides stability for comfort and to protect fractures in the course of treatment.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Is that plaster splint hard or soft?
DR. MOORE: Well, it's plaster of Paris. It hardens like a cast does.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Dr. Moore, does Mr. Depp's description of how his finger became injured line up with the facts that you've seen?
DR. MOORE: No.
DR. MOORE: I have no further questions.
THE COURT: Allright. Cross.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Thank you, Dr. Moore.
THE COURT: Cross-examination.
MS. VASQUEZ: Good morning, Dr. Moore.
DR. MOORE: Good morning.
MS. VASQUEZ: You said you reviewed Mr. Depp's video deposition; is that com:ct?
DR. MOORE: That's correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: And you said you reviewed Mr. Depp's testimony at this trial correct?
DR. MOORE: That's correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: And was that also a video of his testimony?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MS. VASQUEZ: You testified that Mr. Depp demonstrated that his hand was flat on a surface; is that correct?
DR. MOORE: That's correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: That's not entirely accurate, is it, though?
DR. MOORE: No. His description was relatively consistent in both, including turning and resting the hand on the edge.
MS. VASQUEZ: Isn't it true, Dr. Moore, that when Mr. Depp did the demonstration in his deposition, he showed that his fingers were hanging over the bar?
DR. MOORE: Well, even hanging over the bar, it still leaves the dorsum of the hand or the nail vulnerable to - y 1'
MS. VASQUEZ: That's not my question, Dr. Moore. My question is "Isn't it true that Mr. Depp said his fingers were not laying flat on a table; they were hanging over the bar?"
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MS. VASQUEZ: Okay. And, in fact, you knew that when you made that opinion; isn't that correct?
DR. MOORE: Well, I believe that I- as I demonstrated sitting here, that I said that he had said they were slightly curled over I think was the description that I gave.
MS. VASQUEZ: Your description in this courtroom was that it was laying flat, and I think you've done that now twice. But in a deposition, you testified that his fingers were actually hanging over the bar; isn't that correct?
MR. ROTTENBORN: Objection, Your Honor. Misstates the witness' testimony. He clearly indicated they were curled or could have been curled.
THE COURT: Overruled.
DR. MOORE: So that's a distinction that perhaps I misstated in one of the two descriptions. However, that does not substantially change my opinion of the impact it would have on the mechanism.
MS. VASQUEZ: Isn't it true that Mr. Depp also testified that the bottle came from an off angle?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MS. VASQUEZ: Okay. And you considered that in rendering your opinions today, correct?
DR. MOORE: Yes. I believe he stated that it came from between six and ten feet. I think it was off to - I think he demonstrated it was off to his right. I can't recall specifically, but it was off angle, yes.
MS. VASQUEZ: So it didn't come from the top, as you previously testified just a few minutes ago, correct?
DR. MOORE: Well, no. It would have struck the top of the finger, but it may have been slightly off angle in its approach based on the description.
MS. VASQUEZ: Mr. Depp described it as off angle, correct?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: Dr. Moore, just at the outset, your billing rate for providing deposition testimony is a thousand dollars per hour?
DR. MOORE: That's correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: And you were deposed in this action for several hours on March 22nd, 2022?
DR. MOORE: That's correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: And your billing rate for providing trial testimony is $5,000 per day?
DR. MOORE: That's correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: You were retained in this case by Ms. Beard's legal team, correct?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: And over the last few years, you've provided expert services for one of Ms. Beard's law firms on at least two other cases, right?
DR. MOORE: That's correct, yes.
MS. VASQUEZ: Dr. Moore, is it fair to say that you have no personal knowledge as to how Mr. Depp injured his finger in Australia, correct?
DR. MOORE: No, I have no personal knowledge. My, p g y impression is based on his description of the injury and the available medical records for review.
MS. VASQUEZ: But you weren't in Australia with Mr. Depp and Ms. Heard, correct?
DR. MOORE: I was not in Australia, no.
MS. VASQUEZ: And so, therefore, you have no personal knowledge as to how that injury was sustained?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: You also never personally examined Mr. Depp's finger, did you?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: You didn't examine Mr. Depp's finger at the time he was injured?
DR. MOORE: I did not.
MS. VASQUEZ: And you never provided any medical treatment to Mr. Depp in connection with this finger injury, did you?
DR. MOORE: I did not.
MS. VASQUEZ: Now, you've testified that you identified Mr. Depp's finger injury as a crush injury, correct?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: And a crush injury is when a body part is crushed or trapped between two opposing finn surfaces, yes?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MS. VASQUEZ: And a crush injury to a finger can occur when a foreign object hits the finger, Is right?
DR. MOORE: Yes. I 1 O
MS. VASQUEZ: And based on the pictures that you I reviewed of Mr. Depp's finger injury, you cannot determine what particular object caused the injury to his finger, yes?
DR. MOORE: Well, I can't determine exactly what Its object did it. I think that I can say with confidence that the described mechanism of the bottle hitting and shattering the finger was not consistent with the appearance.
MS. VASQUEZ: I understand that.
DR. MOORE: And I think it -
MS. VASQUEZ: My question is just very specific. You can't determine the object that I
MS. VASQUEZ: Caused the injury to Mr. Depp's finger?
DR. MOORE: Well, it's a little bit more of a nonspecific answer. I mean, I - you know, again, I can't determine the exact object, but I can determine that it's unlikely that it was sustained in the manner described.
DR. MOORE: Bottle is a foreign object, isn't it?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MS. VASQUEZ: Okay. So you can't rule out that the injury to Mr. Depp's finger was caused by a vodka I bottle, correct?
DR. MOORE: Well, based on the injury pattern, I ,13 can say that the described mechanism of injury is incident consistent with medical findings.
MS. VASQUEZ: Right. But because a vodka bottle is a I foreign object, you can't rule out that a vodka bottle is what caused Mr. Depp's injury?
DR. MOORE: Well, I can't rule out that a vodka bottle caused the injury, but I can rule out that it was caused in the manner described in his testimony.
MS. VASQUEZ: You can't rule out that the injury was caused by a knife, right?
DR. MOORE: I think it's unlikely that the injury was caused by a knife.
MS. VASQUEZ: But you can't rule it out?
DR. MOORE: Well, a simple knife laceration wouldn't impart the injury to the distal phalanx to result in a comminuted fracture. Now, a chopping-type - but, again, that would likely come from a direction that would create a dorsal injury to create the fracture that was developed
MS. VASQUEZ: Do you remember giving testimony in this case, Dr. Moore?
DR. MOORE: Deposition?
MS. VASQUEZ: Yes.
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MS. VASQUEZ: Okay. And you were under oath, correct?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: All right. And that was on March 22nd, 2022, yes?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: May I approach, Your Honor?
THE COURT: Yes, ma'am.
MS. VASQUEZ: Dr. Moore, may I please have you go to page 163 of your deposition, specifically line 17, 163.
MS. VASQUEZ: Actually, I apologize, 164, line 4.
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: QUESTION: But you can't rule it out completely, right?
MS. VASQUEZ: ANSWER: I can't rule anything out completely. I can't rule out that he caught it in the door, cut it with a knife, or slammed it in the car door. Or again, as Dr. Gilmer said, we can't definitively say what caused this injury.
MS. VASQUEZ: Did I read that correctly?
DR. MOORE: You did
MS. VASQUEZ: Okay.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Your Honor, I would object to incomplete impeachment. I think if she's going to read his answer, she also needs to read, or give Dr. Moore the chance to read, the paragraph below. She just picked out half of his I 1 answer.
THE COURT: You can redirect. I'll I overrule the objection.
DR. MOORE: Yeah. I want to look at the paragraph above.
MS. VASQUEZ: Dr. Moore, there's no question pending. Thank you, though.
MS. VASQUEZ: So you can't rule out that the injury was caused by a car door either; is that right?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: Okay. But it's your testimony, sitting here today, that you can rule out that the injury was caused by a vodka bottle; is that your testimony?
DR. MOORE: My testimony is that I can rule out the injury as caused by the mechanism described by Mr. Depp in his deposition.
MS. VASQUEZ: But you can't definitively say what caused the injury to Mr. Depp's finger?
DR. MOORE: Well, definitively there's a crush injury, but, again, I can't say. I mean, I think it's - I think that it's quite likely that the initial mechanism described at the time of presentation of the accordion doors would classically create the injury pattern. You know, the hand up in front, if you picture accordion doors as the edges close, if the hand's up, the palm is exposed. If the door is closed, hinge closes about the fingers ...
DR. MOORE: Dr. Moore, I understand that, but my question IS --
DR. MOORE: I think it's important that they understand that.
MS. VASQUEZ: This is the time for me to ask you questions. Your counsel will have time to rehabilitate you and ask you questions on redirect. Right now let's try my question.
DR. MOORE: Okay.
MS. VASQUEZ: You can't definitely say what caused the injury to Mr. Depp's finger, yes or no?
DR. MOORE: No.
MS. VASQUEZ: Okay. In conducting your analysis of Mr. Depp's finger injury, you did not attempt to reconstruct the incident; is that right?
DR. MOORE: Well, I think the incident was reconstructed - you mean, did I throw a vodka bottle at something?
MS. VASQUEZ: No, Dr. Moore. I mean you didn't do any type of accident reconstruction, either computerized or any --
DR. MOORE: No.
MS. VASQUEZ: You didn't conduct any type of accident reconstruction of the alleged --
DR. MOORE: No. That's correct. My opinion is based on medical records and the clinical images and Mr. Depp's description.
MS. VASQUEZ: And your analysis is based on an understanding of how Mr. Depp described the exact positioning of his finger at the time of the injury, yes?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MS. VASQUEZ: Okay. And your analysis is also based on the assumption that Mr. Depp's hand remained completely still in the instance that a vodka bottle was hurled at him, yes?
DR. MOORE: No. My assessment is on his description of the vodka bottle striking the top of his finger.
MS. VASQUEZ: But his hand stayed still, according to your own analysis, yes?
DR. MOORE: I guess it was still long enough for the bottle to hit, but natural reaction would be to try to pull away.
MS. VASQUEZ: When you perform traumatic finger surgeries you inquire about the cause of the injuries, correct?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: And your best information on that is typically just a self-report of the patient, yes?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: And your assumption is that the patient is trying to get care -- because the patient is trying to get care that person, that patient, is generally telling the truth, right?
DR. MOORE: You would hope so.
MS. VASQUEZ: Yeah. You reviewed Dr. Kipper's deposition testimony in forming your opinion about Mr. Depp's finger injury, correct?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: In forming your opinion, did you consider Dr. Kipper's deposition testimony that 1: while Dr. Kipper was providing emergency treatment for Mr. Depp --
MR. ROTTENBORN: Objection, Your Honor. May we approach?
THE COURT: Okay.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Your Honor, this is -- you've already excluded this testimony as hearsay. It was in the deposition designations when Dr. Kipper claimed that Mr. Depp told him that this had happened with the vodka bottle as he was picking him up in Australia, Your Honor concluded that testimony from Dr. Kipper's deposition as hearsay.
THE COURT: Well, when Dr. Kipper was testifying.
MS. VASQUEZ: Correct.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Yeah. I understand.
MS. VASQUEZ: He can testify as to -- I
THE COURT: Because he reviewed --
MS. VASQUEZ: He reviewed the deposition.
MR. ROTTENBORN: He can testify as to what he reviewed, but it's being offered by Ms. Vasquez. It's not being offered by us.
THE COURT: Overruled.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Okay.
MS. VASQUEZ: Thank you, Your Honor.
MS. VASQUEZ: BY MS. VASQUEZ:
MS. VASQUEZ: Let's start over because it's important the jury hears this. So in forming your opinion, did you consider Dr. Kipper's deposition testimony that while Dr. Kipper was providing emergency treatment for Mr. Depp's finger injury in Australia in the driveway of the house, Mr. Depp told him that his finger was injured when Ms. Heard threw a vodka bottle at him?
DR. MOORE: I don't - I don't recall that from the deposition. I'd be happy to review it if you have the deposition available.
MS. VASQUEZ: Did you consider Dr. Kipper's testimony that he recalled that Mr. Depp's finger was found in the kitchen?
DR. MOORE: I do recall that.
MS. VASQUEZ: So you must have also seen Dr. Kipper's deposition testimony that he wasn't the one who actually found the finger, correct?
DR. MOORE: That's correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: Dr. Kipper testified that someone he thought was the chef told him he found the finger in the kitchen area, correct?
DR. MOORE: I'm going to assume so, without reading the deposition now.
MS. VASQUEZ: Did you review any testimony from Ben King in rendering your opinions today?
DR. MOORE: Not to my knowledge, no.
MS. VASQUEZ: Did you see any of Mr. King's testimony at this trial?
DR. MOORE: I did not.
MS. VASQUEZ: So you're not aware that Mr. King testified that he's the one who found Mr. Depp's finger, are you?
DR. MOORE: No.
MS. VASQUEZ: And you're not aware that Mr. King testified that he found Mr. Depp's finger in the bar area, right?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: And you're not aware that Mr. King testified he found Mr. Depp's finger in a piece of tissue in the bar area either?
DR. MOORE: No.
MS. VASQUEZ: And you're not aware that Mr. King testified that multiple broken liquor bottles were also found in the bar area, right?
DR. MOORE: Correct.
MS. VASQUEZ: If we could, please pull up Defendant's Exhibit 1817, which is already in evidence. And may it be published, please?
THE COURT: I just don't have it.
MS. VASQUEZ: That would help.
THE COURT: Yes. I just have a blank screen at the moment. There we go.
MS. VASQUEZ: Thank you.
THE COURT: The court: Okay. Dr. Moore?
MS. VASQUEZ: Have you ever seen this picture before,
DR. MOORE: No.
MS. VASQUEZ: So you're not aware that this is the bar area where Mr. King testified he found Mr. Depp's finger?
DR. MOORE: No.
MS. VASQUEZ: Okay. Do you see that broken vodka bottle in the back comer near the bottom of the bar?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MS. VASQUEZ: Okay. Do you see the blood drops on the floor?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MS. VASQUEZ: Can we please pull up Defendant's Exhibit 1820, which is already in evidence.
MS. VASQUEZ: Have you seen this picture before, Dr. Moore?
DR. MOORE: I have not.
MS. VASQUEZ: So you're not aware that this is also a picture from the bar area where Mr. King testified ! he found Mr. Depp's finger?
DR. MOORE: Correct. j 3
MS. VASQUEZ: Do you see the bloody tissue on the . ground at the bottom of the bar?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MS. VASQUEZ: Do you see the blood drops around that tissue?
DR. MOORE: Yes. I 9
MS. VASQUEZ: So you didn't consider any of this I evidence in rendering your opinion about how I Mr. Depp injured his finger in Australia, did you?
DR. MOORE: I did not.
MS. VASQUEZ: Okay.
MS. VASQUEZ: Nothing further, Your Honor. Thank you.
THE COURT: All right. Redirect.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Thank you, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Yes, sir.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Can you pull up Exhibit 1817 that was just shown in the witness, please. And can you blow up what Ms. Vasquez referred to as a broken vodka bottle, Michelle, please.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Dr. Moore, based on your review of the documents in this case, what did you understand to be the size of the bottle of vodka that Mr. Depp alleged cut off his finger?
DR. MOORE: The description was that it was a O handle, a half gallon bottle.
MR. ROTTENBORN: That's bigger than a 750 ml, or fifth, of liquor, correct?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And what size bottle, if -- to the extent that's even a bottle, what size does that appear to be to you?
MS. VASQUEZ: Calls for speculation, Your Honor.
THE COURT: I'll sustain the objection.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Does that appear to be a handle?
MS. VASQUEZ: Objection. Calls for speculation, Your Honor.
THE COURT: I'll sustain the objection.
MR. ROTTENBORN: You can take that
MR. ROTTENBORN: Dr. Moore, Ms. Vasquez just asked you about Dr. Kipper's deposition testimony. And she said is that -- where she claims that Mr. Depp allegedly told him that the finger was severed from a vodka bottle.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Do you remember that question a few IO minutes ago?
MS. VASQUEZ: Objection. Leading.
THE COURT: Overruled.
DR. MOORE: I remember that question, yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Thank you. Is that consistent, that alleged account, is that consistent with the texts you reviewed between Mr. Depp and Dr. Kipper?
DR. MOORE: No.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And what did those texts say?
DR. MOORE: As I recall, Mr. Depp indicated that he had cut his finger off.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Now, Ms. Vasquez wouldn't let you finish when you were trying to explain to the jury PIANE how Mr. Depp's account of injuring his finger in an accordion door would be perfectly consistent with the photographs you saw. Could you please explain that to the jury?
DR. MOORE: Well, so, again, we tend to try to believe patients. We hope that they come in with an honest history initially, and that's a reasonable mechanism for this to have occurred. Again, if you picture your misunderstand up with either a closure of a hinge or closure of the door, the palmar surface is exposed. If it's caught in that hinge as it closes, it can be - it can be slightly off center, it would pinch that tissue away in a similar fashion. But because it's below the level of the nail bed, it could create this injury with the fracture and the tissue loss and preserve the nail bed
MR. ROTTENBORN: Can you look at page 164 of your deposition, the one that Ms. Vasquez just showed you.
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MS. VASQUEZ: Objection, Your Honor. I'm going to object on hearsay grounds.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Your Honor, she is only--
THE COURT: Overruled.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Thank you.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Ms. Vasquez asked you a question and then she read your answer, trying to impeach you, but she only read half your answer. So I'm going to read the whole answer to the jury. And I'm going to ask you to tell me if I'm reading your answer right, okay? The question is on page 164 line 4: "But can't rule ultimate out completely, right?" And you answered: "I can't rule anything out completely. I can't rule out that he caught it any time door, cut it with a knife, or slammed it in the car door. Or, again, as Dr.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Gilmore said, we can't definitively say what caused this injury." And then you go on to say -- this is where Ms. Vasquez cut you off and didn't let you finish -- "What I -- the question" --
MS. VASQUEZ: I don't think that's in the transcript. Objection.
THE COURT: I'll sustain that.
MR. ROTTENBORN: The rest of your answer that she didn't read to you, Dr. Moore, is "What I -- the question I can answer is, is that the mechanism that was described by Mr. Depp and demonstrated by Mr. Depp is inconsistent with the injury pattern that's found on the images and the description."
MR. ROTTENBORN: Did I read that right?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: And does that remain your opinion today?
DR. MOORE: Yes.
MR. ROTTENBORN: Has anything that's been presented to you on cross-examination changed any of the
DR. MOORE: No.
MR. ROTTENBORN: I have nothing further. Thank you, Dr. Moore.
THE COURT: Thank you. Dr. Moore, you're free to go or you can stay in the courtroom. It's up to you, all right? Thank you.